The Inner Game of Growth: The Hidden Habits that Make or Break CEOs

Summary

00:00 - Introduction to Scaling CEOs

02:58 - The Essence of Power Habits

05:50 - Dr. Noah St. John's Journey to Coaching

11:57 - The Inner Game vs. Outer Game of Success

17:53 - Transformative Client Success Stories

22:09 - Understanding Profit Leaks and the Zero Friction Profit Scan

24:38 - The Importance of Goals and Head Trash

26:58 - The Golden Triangle: Money, Meaning, and Freedom

27:55 - Identifying and Overcoming Head Trash

32:44 - Power Habits Framework for CEOs

36:30 - Real-Life Breakthroughs: Client Success Stories

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Full Transcript

Jeff Holman (00:00.622)

Welcome back everybody. I'm Jeff Holman, host of the Breakout CEO Podcast. So excited to have you guys with us today as we talk again about scaling CEOs, the problems, the issues, the inspiration, the reflection, the turning points, the breakout moments that all of you guys are experiencing, maybe on a daily basis even. We've brought on some great guests in the past and I'm excited to have another great guest here with me, Dr. Noah St. John. Welcome to the show.

Dr. Noah St. John (00:27.82)

Thank you, Jeff. Great to be here today.

Jeff Holman (00:29.54)

Yeah, it's fun to have you. I've read through your background a bit and I will confess when I first saw your background, I'm like, my gosh, this guy, I don't know that 30 minutes is going to do it justice. So I'm going to pick a few things out, but feel free to fill in any of the gaps that I might miss because you've got a very extensive background helping CEOs scale, go through the problems and I mean,

Probably hundreds or thousands of stories along the way. We'd love to hear one or two of those today.

Dr. Noah St. John (01:00.63)

Absolutely. Hey, I can always come back. You know, we can always do this again if you want. And because we got a lot to cover, that's for sure. Yes.

Jeff Holman (01:04.604)

Yeah, this is just the beginning. So yeah, I appreciate that. So you've written, I think it said here, let's see, 25 books. Is that right? Okay. Out of those 25 books, I don't know if this is an exercise we can do, but we're going to try it. Which of your 25 books, they're all awesome, I'm sure. Which of your 25 books is the one that our audience of scaling CEOs, people who are

Dr. Noah St. John (01:16.311)

Yes, sir.

Jeff Holman (01:30.768)

You know, they're building teams, they've got product market fit, but they're trying to grow now, right? They're testing out pricing, they're testing out distribution channels, they're maybe dabbling with their products and services a bit, but those are mostly dialed in. Like which book would be a good one to turn to as a starting point to get to know you, Dr. Noah?

Dr. Noah St. John (01:54.21)

Well, you know, in my 30 years of helping CEOs and founders, entrepreneurs, business owners from all around the world, over 140 countries now, you know, I've helped my clients add over $3 billion collectively, meaning, you know, add multiple seven and eight figures and even nine figures, you know, in many, many cases. And so, you know, the one book that really stands out that, you my clients tell me they really enjoyed.

Jeff Holman (02:10.093)

Yeah.

Dr. Noah St. John (02:18.722)

is called Power Habits. It's this one right here. I don't know if that's backwards for you, but it's Power Habits. Anyway, it's if you go to NoahStJohn.com and then just click on the Books tab. There's a tab there that says Books and you can see a list of some of my most popular books. But Power Habits is really the one that really gives you the essence of my work and one of the main reasons that I've helped my clients add so many

Jeff Holman (02:20.368)

it's right there even good. Nice.

Dr. Noah St. John (02:43.022)

billions of dollars, know, really literally over $3 billion while winning their lives back at the same time. So this is the opposite of the hustle and grind. You know, we've heard that a million times. If you just got a hustle and grind, know, the secret to success is hard work. Really? Okay. If that were true, then ditch diggers would be, you know, the richest people in the world. So that's not true. I'm not, I'm not saying anything bad about hard work. I'm just saying that's not it. That's not the answer. Uh, so anyway, that's that to answer your question, power habits really would be the one that, uh,

Jeff Holman (02:47.779)

Mm-hmm.

Jeff Holman (02:55.544)

Yeah.

Jeff Holman (03:00.431)

Right, right.

Dr. Noah St. John (03:12.546)

that people a lot of people start with and grow from.

Jeff Holman (03:15.599)

Yeah, no, and that's a pretty ripe field, right? I think I read 20 years ago, the seven habits of highly effective people and there's some somewhere along the way, maybe in my MBA program, I read atomic habits or there's a lot of things out there. What's the essence of power habits? maybe we'll get into this a little bit more, but give us the teaser for power habits and where that sits in the.

Dr. Noah St. John (03:35.95)

Absolutely. Well, I love it. I love that you mentioned those books because they're those are examples of books that talk about habits. You know, there's there's millions of books that talk about habits and all that stuff. The problem is that when you look at seven habits or atomic habits or things like that, they're talking about the conscious habits of successful people. So what I teach is different is what I call the power habits of unconsciously successful people. Now, that's a mouthful, but I'll break it down for you. It's very simple.

Jeff Holman (03:43.993)

Yeah.

Jeff Holman (03:54.84)

Mm-hmm.

Dr. Noah St. John (04:05.207)

What I realized in over 40 years of research and experiment and making every mistake in the book and interviewing tons of successful people, what I realized is that highly successful people are doing things unconsciously that they can't even tell you they're doing, number one, and therefore, number two, they can never teach it to you. They don't even realize they're doing it. So these are the unconscious habits. So it goes back to the iceberg principle of human behavior. I'm sure most people listening to this program know that

Jeff Holman (04:25.295)

Yeah.

Jeff Holman (04:32.367)

Mm-hmm.

Dr. Noah St. John (04:34.975)

about 5 % of our thoughts, behaviors, and actions as human beings are on the conscious level. So that's like the top part of the iceberg, right? The 5 % that you can see that's above the surface. But meanwhile, the vast 95 % is below the surface. Well, that's the unconscious or subconscious habits. And so what I always tell my clients, you know, as a keynote speaker, I get to speak to conferences, teams, organizations, events all around the country and around the world, whether live or virtually.

Jeff Holman (04:44.59)

Right.

Dr. Noah St. John (05:02.881)

And what I'll often say to my audience members is, you know, I talk about the iceberg prints when I'll show them the iceberg. And most people have seen that and are familiar with it by now. But what I'll say is that the point is that it wasn't the part of the iceberg that they could see that sunk the Titanic. It was the part they didn't see that sunk the Titanic. And that's what's sinking all of us as well. It's the unconscious habits. And that's really the essence of my power habits. And it's also one of the reasons why people who've studied all those other

Jeff Holman (05:12.014)

Yeah.

Jeff Holman (05:20.303)

You

Dr. Noah St. John (05:32.759)

conscious habits going to all the other programs and seminars and gurus, but they still are hitting that wall. They're hitting what I call an income ceiling. And after I coach them, whether it's one-on-one coaching or group coaching, you know, they really get that hockey stick growth as a result of following and installing my power habit system.

Jeff Holman (05:39.353)

Yeah.

Jeff Holman (05:52.176)

That's awesome. That sounds like you just described breakout moments coming from utilizing your power habits. I want to get into that because I'm really intrigued by the idea of, you know, we want to, we're having a conscious conversation now and I want to know how to unlock the unconscious side that really is behind the scenes. But before we do that, tell us how you got to this point. what's your path from, you know, what was kind of your first moment where you said, hey, maybe I ought to be coaching people or maybe you had a business of your own.

Like tell us a little bit of background about yourself.

Dr. Noah St. John (06:25.089)

Well, I grew up poor in a rich neighborhood. And I know that's a total cliche, but it's totally true. I grew up in this little town called Kennybungport, Maine, which is one of the wealthiest communities in New England. But my family was dirt poor. And I mean that literally because we lived at the bottom of a dirt road in a drafty unfinished house that my parents ended up losing to foreclosure when I was just 15 years old. So from a very young age, I was painfully exposed to the gap, the chasm between the haves

Jeff Holman (06:27.561)

Jeff Holman (06:37.795)

Yeah.

Jeff Holman (06:46.696)

wow.

Dr. Noah St. John (06:52.557)

and to have nots, to have, as everyone else in the community, to have nots was my family. And so I hated being poor. I just hated it. You you hear motivational speakers all the time that get on stage and say, well, we were poor, but we were happy. We didn't know we were poor. Well, I'll tell you what, in my family, we freaking knew we were poor because my mother, bless her heart, reminded us every day that we were poor and miserable. So no, it wasn't happy, it sucked. And so I hated being poor. And so I said, how the heck do I get out of this? Because I saw that right down the street.

Jeff Holman (06:53.73)

Yeah.

Jeff Holman (06:57.102)

Yeah.

Jeff Holman (07:08.387)

Hahaha.

Jeff Holman (07:12.76)

Yeah.

Dr. Noah St. John (07:20.567)

There's great wealth and abundance. So how the heck do I get from here to there? And of course there was no internet or anything back then. So I the only thing I could think of, which is I went to the library and I read every book in the self-help section. I just immersed myself. I read over 300 books, every book in the self-help section, the classics, Dale Carnegie, Napoleon Hill, Stephen Covey, not all the rest. And I really tried to apply it, but as hard as I worked, as hard as I tried, I just couldn't get it to work. And so at the age of 25,

Jeff Holman (07:23.961)

Yeah.

Jeff Holman (07:39.917)

Yep. Yep.

Dr. Noah St. John (07:47.79)

I actually decided to commit suicide. I decided to take my own life because I was so frustrated that I've been studying all this for so many years and I had nothing to show for it. Now at the very last moment, my life was spared, but I didn't know why. And so I realized at that point in my life, I've got to find what is my purpose here on the earth. And I didn't know how to answer that. So I went back to the library and this time I read every book in the spiritual section. just immersed myself in that. And then fast forward to 1997, I had these epiphanies.

Jeff Holman (07:51.844)

Wow.

Jeff Holman (08:10.436)

Hmm.

Dr. Noah St. John (08:16.865)

when I realized exactly what was missing in all those books that I'd spent all those years reading that no one was talking about. And I realized, aha, this is my message. This is my mission. And so I wrote my very first book called Permission to Succeed. I self-published it. And then it was subsequently published by the Chicken Soup for the Soul Publisher. And now I'm the only author in history to have works published by Hay House, HarperCollins, Simon & Schuster, Mindvalley.

Nightingale Conan and the Chicken Soup for the Soul Publisher. No one else in history has ever done that. Not Tony Robbins, not Wayne Dyer, not Deepak Chopra. None of them. Just a little old me. So, you know, with all of that, all these books published and really all the people that I've helped, you know, the real proof in the pudding is the results. You know, the results from my clients that have made, have added over $3 billion collectively.

Jeff Holman (08:49.315)

Wow. Wow.

Jeff Holman (09:02.255)

Yeah.

Dr. Noah St. John (09:09.377)

And most importantly, win their lives back, know, getting their lives back. So it's not the hustle and grind. It's literally it goes back to why you started your business in the first place.

Jeff Holman (09:18.807)

Yeah, man, there's a lot in there. That's quite the full story. want to just for reference, tell me if I've got this wrong, but I've heard of Kenny Bunkport, Maine. I think I've driven through it one time, but that's where presidents go to vacation, right?

Dr. Noah St. John (09:32.525)

That's right. That's correct. Yeah. The Bush is the Bush family. They actually, the Bush family essentially started Kenny bunk. They founded the town in the 1800s and that's why it's known for HW and W Bush. So yeah, it's a, it's pretty famous by now. Yes.

Jeff Holman (09:45.784)

Yep, And that's where I've heard of it. So growing up poor there is different from what I would have seen if they showed the president, know, President Bush on vacation at his family estate or whatever he might have there.

Dr. Noah St. John (09:59.662)

Right. mean, we drove by there in the school bus every single day. drove by the Bush residents long before any of them were president. And we really didn't think anything of it. So when you grow up in that environment, you're like, this is normal. And then I realized this is not normal.

Jeff Holman (10:15.093)

Right, right. Well, and so what's, we don't have to dig too far, but like, what's one of those personality traits or habits that you developed at that, at a young age? I mean, you didn't want to be poor. You knew you were poor. You said your mom, maybe, you know, thankfully, or, yeah, what's a character building aspect of that that you've taken away and built on?

Dr. Noah St. John (10:31.223)

Right? She reminded us every day. So yeah, was not too hard.

Dr. Noah St. John (10:42.049)

Well, when you look at my power habit system, you know, one of the things that makes it different is that I really look at things from two aspects of what really creates this phenomenon called success. And that is the inner game and the outer game. So if you think about a Venn diagram with two circles that intersect in the middle. And when you read my books or when you attend any of my seminars or coaching, you'll notice I use tons of Venn diagrams. I'm just such a nerd. love Venn diagrams because they really tell you a picture, you know, they paint a picture very clearly. Well, this is.

Jeff Holman (10:49.775)

Mm-hmm.

Jeff Holman (10:59.833)

Mm-hmm.

Jeff Holman (11:06.019)

Good.

Dr. Noah St. John (11:12.001)

My favorite Venn diagram of all time, which is just two circles, one says inner game and one says outer game. So the inner game is everything that happens between your ears that you can't see directly, but it affects everything that you do. So for example, in my keynote speeches, when I'm speaking, whether live or virtually to companies, teams, organizations, I'll often say to my audience members, what's one area of your life where your beliefs don't affect you? And then people will go, hmm. And I go, exactly. There's no place your beliefs don't affect you.

Jeff Holman (11:17.103)

Okay.

Jeff Holman (11:41.71)

Yeah.

Dr. Noah St. John (11:41.868)

Right? Your beliefs affect your health, your wellbeing, your stress level. Your beliefs affect your money, your wealth, your status, your success. Your beliefs affect your relationships, right? Your personal life, your family life, your social life. There's no place your beliefs don't affect you. But here's the interesting thing. You can't see a belief. You can only see the effects of a belief. So that's why you can be doing really well in one area, but maybe you're stuck or struggling in another. For example, maybe your health is good, but you're not making the money you want or vice versa. Maybe you're making

Jeff Holman (11:50.861)

Right.

Jeff Holman (11:59.024)

Mm-hmm.

Dr. Noah St. John (12:10.561)

good money, but your health or your relationships are suffering. Let's face it, there's a lot of miserable millionaires out there. So you don't want to do that. So that's your inner game. But then we also have your outer game. Your outer game is everything you can see directly. Right? That's all of the blocking and tackling, the marketing, sales, customer service, all the things that we have to do as CEOs, founders, entrepreneurs. But the problem is that unless you master both the inner game and the outer game, you're always going to hit that income ceiling. Let me give you a quick example.

Jeff Holman (12:12.845)

Yeah, yep. We see that a lot, don't we? Yeah.

Dr. Noah St. John (12:38.145)

I was speaking at a seminar in Los Angeles for a thousand business owners, entrepreneurs, CEOs. These are seven, eight, and even nine figure founders. So I finished my presentation. I was walking off the stage and a man came up to me and he said, Noah, I want to hire you as my coach. You are the coach I've been looking for. Now I didn't know this man from Adam. Ironically, his name was Adam. True story. You can watch his video and hundreds of others on my website. But anyway, I said, okay, well what's going on? He said, well,

Jeff Holman (12:45.313)

Mm-hmm.

Jeff Holman (12:58.383)

You

Dr. Noah St. John (13:06.197)

Noah, I own this company and we grew to seven figures really fast, but we have been stuck at the same level for the past four years. He said, four years we've been stuck. And he said, I have spent hundreds of thousands of dollars. I've spent so much money. I've hired every marketing guru on the planet, know, named all the big names. And he said, we still can't break through that income ceiling. And he said, as soon as I heard you speak about inner game and outer game and head trash and power habits, everything you just said, he said, I knew.

Jeff Holman (13:10.435)

Yeah.

Jeff Holman (13:22.937)

Right.

Dr. Noah St. John (13:32.056)

that you were the coach I've been looking for. So he literally decided to hire me on the spot. That's why I love working with high achievers, right? Because they make decisions quickly and firmly. Don't dilly dally, I gotta think about it. Let me talk to my spouse. No, let's do it. So anyway, he decided to hire me on the spot and I coached him and his leadership team for 18 months. And in that 18 months, we were able to get his company that had been plateaued for the previous four years to over 20 million in revenues in less than 18 months. That's a 600 % increase.

Jeff Holman (13:37.603)

Yeah.

It clicked. It clicked for him. Yeah.

Dr. Noah St. John (14:01.229)

in 18 months. Now, most CEOs will be thrilled with a 10%, a 15 % increase. They'd be thrilled. 600 %? That's off the chart. So that's what we like to call hockey stick growth, right? You're kind of going along like this and then whop, you we put our power, we put, install my power habits system and then whoop, we just go through the roof. So that's an example of how powerful these power habits really can be.

Jeff Holman (14:24.591)

That's fantastic. I want to hear more about maybe that story or similar stories like it. But I don't want to skip over one thing you said earlier and that is, you you're talking about the inner game and you mentioned, you know, you'd been through this, I'll call it an episode in your life where things weren't going well and you contemplated suicide. You know, I have a period in my life, I haven't done that myself, but I'm very sensitive to it. I've got family members who've...

Dr. Noah St. John (14:45.153)

Yes.

Jeff Holman (14:51.787)

been through things like that. And one year I remember it really struck me hard when a neighbor, a very successful neighbor growing up, know, pro athlete had had been through some things and his solution, you know, right or wrong, it's not my place to judge it, was to take his life. And that hit me hard. And I think, I think there's an aspect of people who are in CEO positions, you know, from the outside, you look at them and you're like, man, these guys are successful.

They get all these speaking gigs and they're making tons of money, I'm sure. And everybody laughs at all their jokes. But you and I, we've been sitting in the office when they come back to their office. I'm talking about legal, you're talking about inner game, outer game with them. And you see that that can be a really lonely position for a lot of people. They don't have the peer groups always, or the coaches or the people they can talk to. I've sat there, I've...

At one point I said to myself, I mean, you're the attorney, but, man, you're a counselor. Like this guy need might need some counseling and whether he wants to take advantage of it or not. You know, I've said to a few CEOs, I'm like, listen, you're in a position. I know it's really lonely. It I'm a pretty good confidant. I might not have the, you know, the techniques and skills to, to coach or to be your therapist. But if you need to talk to anybody about anything, you know, I'm here and I'm available. Not many people take advantage of it, but it's.

Dr. Noah St. John (15:55.661)

That's right.

Jeff Holman (16:19.699)

But they need that. And there's an aspect, right? You've seen, I guess I could say you've seen both sides of that. You see the CEOs you work with, but you've dealt with like the kind of the depths of it on your own, it sounds like too.

Dr. Noah St. John (16:21.303)

It's...

Dr. Noah St. John (16:26.593)

Yes.

Dr. Noah St. John (16:33.948)

Yes, absolutely. And you're right. You know, there's that old phrase, it's lonely at the top. And it truly can be. It really can be for a lot of CEOs, a lot of founders, because, you know, they're working really hard and it's not like you can go to your employees or your contractors or if you have virtual assistants or whatever and you know, and the spouse, right? It's like, oh my God, you know, enough of this already. You know, we've heard it a million times. So it is, it can be really hard. It actually reminds me of

Jeff Holman (16:50.017)

or your spouse doesn't necessarily want to hear about it again, right?

Yeah.

Dr. Noah St. John (17:01.133)

one of my clients, his name is Charles, he actually told me that, speaking of my Power Habits book that I mentioned earlier, he told me when we first spoke that he was in Barnes and Noble and walked by my Power Habits book three times. He just kept walking by it. And he said, something called out to me about this book. And he said, I had to get it. So he got it. He said he read about half of it. And then he contacted me on my website. He said, Noah, I got to hire you. mean, you like Adam, you you're the coach I've been looking for.

And I said, okay, well, that's great. And, know, just talking to him about what was going on. And I said, you know, I'm just curious, how much do you think it's going to cost you? if we don't install this, if, we don't do this, how much it's going to cost you, how much you think you're losing out on? And without batting an eye, said a million dollars. said, I'm easily going to lose a million dollars this year, Noah, if we don't install these power habits, you know, and get rid of, as I call it, you know, take out my head trash. That's the one other term that I use. Right. And

Jeff Holman (17:37.304)

Mm-hmm.

Dr. Noah St. John (17:54.573)

because he realized he was hitting that income ceiling, but most of it was in our game, right? Which it is for 99 % of my clients. Anyway, so I said, you know, Charles, I hear that all the time. I hear it every day. So I tell you what, why don't you just give me 10 % of that million? Just give me 10 % and I'll find you a million dollars in the next 12 months. In other words, if you give me a dollar and I give you $10 back, is that a good deal? He goes, yeah, that's a good deal. Let's do it. So he literally decided to hire me on the spot, paid me 100K for a year of coaching. That's 10 % of a million, right? So I coached him and as it turns out,

Jeff Holman (18:19.983)

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Dr. Noah St. John (18:23.789)

I didn't find him a million dollars in the next 12 months. Instead, I found him 1.8 million in just 10 months. So he gave me $1. I gave him $18 back. Is that a good deal? No, that's a great deal. And he actually sent me an email. Exactly, right? And he actually emailed me and he said, Hey Noah, guess where I am right now? I'm on a seven week vacation with my wife. He said, this is a dream I've had for last 20 years, but I never had the time or the money. He said, we just bought a new RV. This is what we've always wanted to do. Drive around the country, just take an RV trip.

Jeff Holman (18:29.944)

Wow.

Yeah.

Better than e-commerce ROAS right now, isn't it?

Jeff Holman (18:47.854)

Yeah.

Dr. Noah St. John (18:53.857)

We took seven weeks off and he said, I'm making more money than ever and I have more time than ever. This has never happened before. So we literally said, thank you Noah for changing my life. So you see, that's how powerful this really is. And I want people to listening to realize that how much is it costing you? If you keep holding yourself back, if you keep that income ceiling, if you keep listening to, as I call it, your head trash, how much is it costing you? A million, five million, 10 million? I mean, you might not know. Now I do have...

Jeff Holman (19:12.751)

Mm-hmm.

Dr. Noah St. John (19:21.621)

a way for you to find that out actually on our website. If you go to know us, St. John, you can actually click on, it's called the zero friction CEO. There's a zero friction gap audit and you can actually take that. It's a free audit. Yeah. So, so one of the things that I've realized in helping my clients make billions of dollars is that every business problem you're facing right now is a friction problem. And that's why you need a zero friction solution. So think about what is friction. So, I'll use an analogy. So

Jeff Holman (19:28.591)

Okay. I was just going to ask about that.

Dr. Noah St. John (19:49.325)

Your goals are like driving your car. Right? So let's say you have a destination, your goal, right? Everybody talks about goals. I've heard that a million times. Right? So what's your goal? Well, I want to get to 10 million. I want to get to 50 million. I want to get to a hundred million, whatever the number is. Right. And that's just money, you know, so what do you want with your life and so on, you know, so there's lots of different goals that we have, but let's just take money because it's an easy one. Right. I'm making X and I want to make Y. Great. Easy to measure. So that's like driving your car to the grocery store.

Jeff Holman (20:01.359)

Mm-hmm.

Jeff Holman (20:13.379)

Yeah, easy to measure.

Dr. Noah St. John (20:19.156)

Right? So the grocery store is your destination. Why do you want to get there? Well, I need milk and eggs. OK, great. That's where you're going and why you're going there. All right. So number one, most people don't know where they're going. Number two, they don't know why they're going there. So that's right off the bat. But let's say you do know where you want to go and why you want to get there. You're driving your car, right? Well, in your car, there are two forces at work. The force of the gas, which is propelling you forward, and the force of the brake, which is slowing you down or stopping you. Well, guess what? Ninety nine percent of entrepreneurs

Jeff Holman (20:21.412)

Mm-hmm.

Dr. Noah St. John (20:48.266)

and all of the people that I've coached over last 30 years are driving down the road of life with one foot on the brake. They're unknowingly, unconsciously, unwittingly driving down the road of life with one foot on the brake. Now, if you are applying the brakes to your life, what do you think is happening? Exactly, you're slowing yourself down, right? And guess what? You're applying tons of force on the gas, right?

Jeff Holman (21:04.815)

Yeah. Yeah.

Jeff Holman (21:12.792)

Yeah, yeah.

Dr. Noah St. John (21:13.376)

But you're holding yourself back exactly like Adam, like Charles, like every, if you go on my website, you'll see hundreds of stories. Every single one of them is, was doing what I'm talking about before they came to me, before they hired me. They had all this, what I call hidden friction. They didn't know it was there. If you know it's there, you get rid of it, but you don't know. That's why we give you, so on our website, on knowasaintjohn.com, you just click where it says zero friction CEO. You take a two minute as we call it the zero friction gap audit. It's an audit.

Jeff Holman (21:41.999)

Mm-hmm.

Dr. Noah St. John (21:42.529)

And you're answering it yourself. I'm not telling you where it is. You're telling yourself, right? And then we have what's called the zero friction profit scan. Now the zero friction gap audit is kind of like going to a general practitioner. If you have a cold, you're like, I'm not feeling so hot. Let's go to the, you know, just go to the general practitioner, you know, or go to CVS or whatever, you know, it's, it's a, it's a free, it's a free thingy. But if you realize, wait a minute, Noah, this is actually costing me a lot of money right now.

I think I need a little bit more in depth than the zero friction profit scan is like a CAT scan. It's like a CAT scan for your brain. All so I'm the neurosurgeon. I've done thousands of these surgeries. So yeah, so there is a very, very small investment compared to what you're losing right now. So there's a small investment for the profit scan after you take the audit. So it's like the difference between going to a general practitioner and going to a neurosurgeon. So yes, there is a small investment for that. But the point is, and what I love about it is,

Jeff Holman (22:18.895)

Okay.

Jeff Holman (22:29.071)

Mm-hmm.

Dr. Noah St. John (22:40.716)

with the zero friction profit scan, if we don't find a quarter million dollars of profit leaks, know, literally money that you're leaking, then your scan is free. And guess what? In 30 years, I've never had to do that. I've never had to refund anyone's money ever for that reason, because you're always losing way more than you think. And it's hidden. Your CFO can't see it because it's not on a spreadsheet. It's not on your balance sheet. It's hidden. And 99 % of the time, it's hidden right up here.

Jeff Holman (22:53.581)

Yeah.

Yeah.

Jeff Holman (23:08.367)

Well, I want to understand too, because these are awesome tools, I think maybe for some CEOs, especially early stage, first time CEOs, it's about the grind, it's the hustle, it's work harder, it's not so much a... Well, yeah, and in the...

Dr. Noah St. John (23:19.404)

That's right. Right. That's all we hear from the gurus. It's all that you hear on social media. just hustle and grind. I'm like, dude, how about life? You know, why did you start this business so you could work all the time? No, I'm sorry. I didn't mean to cut you off. I just get a little worked up here. I'm sorry.

Jeff Holman (23:29.475)

Yeah.

Jeff Holman (23:33.784)

Right, You're, no, you're totally fine. It's a passion topic for both of us, I think. But because I see a lot of first time founders and you do, hear the same stories over and over. And I think some of them, if I put myself in their position, which I often try to do from the legal perspective, well now, tell me, why exactly are we trying to do this, right? But when I think about it, yeah.

Dr. Noah St. John (23:49.548)

Right? Right.

Exactly. Because they told me that's that's 90 % of the answers because they told me to. Who's they? Why are you listening to them?

Jeff Holman (24:03.203)

That's what I heard. Well, help me understand then a little bit more in depth. What's the, there's the gap analysis, the profit assessment that you do. For somebody who's saying to themselves, like I want to work on my own leadership skills. That makes sense. I want my business to be doing better. That makes sense. Help me connect. How does working on my habits, my unconscious habits have that direct correlation with

Dr. Noah St. John (24:18.956)

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Jeff Holman (24:32.589)

business performance. Is it just because the two are correlated, generally speaking, or is there something more there?

Dr. Noah St. John (24:40.288)

That goes back to something I mentioned briefly that now we can dive into a little bit deeper, which is that phrase I call head trash. All right. So what is head trash? I've written 25 books basically on this one subject, which is how to take out the head trash that's holding you back right now. So going back to your goals, right? It's always goes back to your goals. What is it you want? Right. And it's about what you want. That's a very important thing to say. It's about what you, the CEO, the founder, the entrepreneur, the business owner, what do you want? And why did you get into business in the first place?

Jeff Holman (24:47.331)

OK.

Jeff Holman (25:09.529)

Mm-hmm.

Dr. Noah St. John (25:09.772)

Was it so you have a low paying job? No, it's because you want the three things that we all want, money, meaning and freedom. That's what I call the golden triangle, right? The three corners of the golden triangle is money. We want money, no duh, right? But a lot of people are embarrassed to talk about it. No, but no, we want money. It's a perfectly nice thing to have. Last time I checked on planet earth, right? But we also want meaning, right? Because what good is tons of money if you have no meaning in your life? That goes back to what I was saying earlier. A lot of miserable millionaires out there.

Jeff Holman (25:12.088)

No, no.

Jeff Holman (25:23.695)

Yeah.

Dr. Noah St. John (25:37.505)

Right. And, you know, like your example of that successful person, which we hear this all the time and, know, they take their own life or they sabotage or whatever it might be. Right. So that's from a lack of meaning and then freedom. You didn't start your business so you could be chained to your business. I mean, when I was working, when I was starting my business many years ago, I was working down on those 18 hour days, you know, like we here. I mean, you just sometimes you just have to do that. And I get it.

Jeff Holman (25:45.903)

Mm-hmm.

Jeff Holman (26:00.162)

Yeah.

Right, right.

Dr. Noah St. John (26:04.064)

But that shouldn't be your life. That shouldn't be the whole time, you know, 10, 20, 30 years you're in business. No, exactly. exactly. And so, I mean, literally, and this is one the things that literally woke me up many years ago. My wife, you know, because I was working all the time and, know, I'd be, come on, honey, you know, I got to work. And finally, one day she showed up at the office and she had this sign and it said, come out and play. And that's when I realized, Noah, what are you doing? Why are you doing this?

Jeff Holman (26:08.653)

Certainly not the end goal. That's not the grocery store destination we're driving for.

Jeff Holman (26:22.457)

Yeah, yeah.

Dr. Noah St. John (26:32.926)

And that's, you know, it was like a light bulb. And I went, my God, you know, I'm helping people to, you know, get their lives back, but I'm working and I don't have a life. So it was like, boom. So I said, you know what, forget you. And I'm just, I'm going to do what I say. Right. Great idea. When I'm teaching other people and you know, then I started taking the family on trips to Hawaii and Florida, you know, having fun. Like what a concept. So anyway, money, meaning and freedom. That's what we want. All right. So the point is.

What is holding you back? Why don't you have it right now? Well, for most entrepreneurs, CEOs, founders that I coached over the last 30 years, all of them in fact, the answer really boils down to this concept that I call head trash. So what is head trash? Head trash is the voice in your head that says, I can't do it because dot dot dot. And then you just fill in the blank. So, you know, your goal is I want to go from a million to 10 million. I want to go from 10 million to 50 million, 50 million to 100, whatever. Right. But I can't do it because dot.

Dot, dot. no, you know, I don't have the time. I don't have the money. I don't know who to trust. I've tried everything already. you know, there's so many scam artists out there and what if it works for everyone else and not for me? I I've heard it a million times. I've heard every excuse a million times. And you know what's so funny is you always make yourself right. Every single person listening to this program, everyone listening to sound of my voice, I really want you to hear this. You always make yourself right. So if you keep telling yourself,

Jeff Holman (27:38.007)

What if it doesn't work? Yeah.

Dr. Noah St. John (27:57.013)

Well, Noah, I want to grow my business, but I can't do it because blank. You're right. You're right. And this is one instance you don't want to be right.

Jeff Holman (28:08.897)

No, no, this is the concept of the inner thermostat, right? Like we get a little too high, we bring ourselves back down subconsciously, unconsciously, consciously, whatever it is. Is that a comfort thing? Is it a fear thing? What, like, where does, why do we have head trash? Why can't we just live without this head trash?

Dr. Noah St. John (28:13.844)

I... That's right.

That's right.

Dr. Noah St. John (28:25.932)

Well, that really, I love that question because what's so funny is all of those guys, gurus that, you know, we've been following, we've been listening to, they don't have had trash. And so like a perfect example, I've told the story a thousand times is my good friend, Gary Vaynerchuk. Now we all know Gary Vaynerchuk, know, big, big successful guy. Now I had the unique experience and nobody else has this experience of hosting him many, many years ago.

Jeff Holman (28:44.717)

Yeah, yeah.

Dr. Noah St. John (28:54.57)

when he was doing his very first book tour here in Ohio. So I actually contacted his office. I saw he was gonna be here and I said, hey, hey, can I host Gary? You know, can pick him up at the airport and just host him. They were like, yeah, that sounds great. We were looking for somebody to do that. I'm like, perfect. Believe me, you couldn't do that today. That's long gone, right? Unless you wanna pay him $200,000 or whatever. But anyway, so I picked him up. I hosted him for two days and I swear to God, and I swear this is true, I hosted him for two days. We were together, you know, pretty much the whole time.

Jeff Holman (28:57.905)

okay.

Jeff Holman (29:10.103)

Yeah, yeah.

Right.

Dr. Noah St. John (29:24.556)

I never saw him eat or go to the bathroom one time in two days. And finally, I looked at him and you remember that movie Terminator 2? Did ever see that movie with Arnold Schwarzenegger? Well, anyway, Terminator 2, you guys can Google it. But anyway, there's one point where the kid goes to Arnold Schwarzenegger and he goes like this. He pokes him in the cheek. He goes like this. He's a cyborg, right? He's not human. So I literally did that to Gary. said, what are you?

Jeff Holman (29:29.452)

Okay.

Jeff Holman (29:34.655)

I'm terrible with movies, so explain the context for me. Yep, yep.

Jeff Holman (29:46.637)

Right, right.

Dr. Noah St. John (29:52.077)

What are you a cyborg? What are you? You don't sleep. You don't eat. You don't go to the bathroom. What are you? So he kind of laughed. It's like, I just don't really need to eat them. I'm like, oh my God, I'm exhausted being with you. What does this story mean? Why am I telling this story? Because those are the types of people that, you know, we're supposed to be like, I'm like, dude, I can't do that. You know, I'm human. I'm mortal. We can't do it. We can't do what you do. See, so they're sure they're great. And they're successful. But as an example, they're they're kind of lousy. You know, they're

Jeff Holman (30:01.71)

Wow.

Jeff Holman (30:14.232)

We-

Jeff Holman (30:20.567)

It's hard to follow them when we're full of head trash. It's hard for us. Yeah.

Dr. Noah St. John (30:20.886)

They're not because we can't do that. And he doesn't, he clearly has no head trash, none. He came out of the womb knowing I'm gonna be a billionaire. I'm gonna own the Jets, whatever. And it's like, that's great for you, buddy. But how about the rest of us, you know? I'm human, I'm mortal.

Jeff Holman (30:30.991)

You

Jeff Holman (30:34.893)

So should we be, should we mere mortals be trying to replicate that or is it, are we just getting a step closer? Okay.

Dr. Noah St. John (30:42.122)

Well, that's what my power habit system does. It evens the playing field for us mere mortals. That's literally what it does because those guys are great, but they're no help. They're just no help because, know, like one of their most famous quotes that they all say is, Hey, if you want to succeed, just believe in yourself. that's great. I'm sitting in the back of the room going, but I don't believe in myself. What am I supposed to do? Well, you know, you're fired. It's seriously, you see what I mean? It's okay. It's right, but it doesn't mean anything. How the.

Jeff Holman (30:50.188)

Okay, yeah.

Jeff Holman (30:57.709)

Yeah, yeah.

Jeff Holman (31:04.27)

Yeah.

Uh-huh.

Dr. Noah St. John (31:10.09)

I don't believe myself and 99 % of people don't either. We've got this thing called head trash. You're not human. You're not helping. I know, I'm sorry. I'm getting all really fired up here. I apologize.

Jeff Holman (31:12.963)

Yeah.

Jeff Holman (31:17.507)

We're in our, no, no, no, we're in our heads. do the same thing like when I'm, play tennis with my son, I've played tennis with my daughters when they were still in the house and we go play. And sometimes I just look at them like, hey, just relax. Like stop thinking about it too much. You're in your own head. Like just, you know, your muscles know how to do this forehand swing or this backhand. Just let yourself go. I think that is in the phrase where I'm in my head, you're in your head. That is head trash, right?

Dr. Noah St. John (31:35.756)

That's right. That's right.

Dr. Noah St. John (31:44.225)

That's right. That's right. mean, look at golf, right? I've helped tons of golfers and professional athletes to get what's called the yips, right? The yips, you've probably heard of that, right? The yips is you're in your head. God, how do I putt? You've putted 10 million times. What are you doing? You know, so I helped them get back to, you know, their natural state. That's just another example.

Jeff Holman (31:52.567)

Yeah. Yep.

Jeff Holman (32:03.087)

That's funny, I golfed with a very good golfer friend one time and he's like, you know, we're maybe hole 12. And I'm like, yeah, whatever. I kind of done what I'd wanted to do for the day. And he's like, you know, Jeff, you could be a really good golfer if you just focus. And I'm like, I don't know if I have the focus. I don't know if I have like the ability for 18 holes of golf. But I think that's what you're talking about. It's like, how do we get that focus? How do we get the head trash out? How do we fill our head with the right things? Maybe subconscious actions so that we get the...

the unconscious habits going. Tell me, maybe give me a flavor of the framework or the tools that CEOs use with you to develop these unconscious powers.

Dr. Noah St. John (32:45.644)

Yeah, absolutely. So yeah, if you went when you read Power Habits, I when you when you get the Power Habits book or listen on audio, just talking about the client of mine, he looked listen to it on three speed on audible. I got through it in like two days. I'm like, good, good job, buddy. Anyway, on page 100. There it is. I mean, that is the system right there. There are 11 total power habits and you'll recognize like Da Vinci's man. That's like the diagram we use. But so there are 11 total power habits. And remember, these are the unconscious habits that, you know, Gary Vaynerchuk and others like that would never

Jeff Holman (32:58.179)

Awesome.

Okay.

Jeff Holman (33:05.005)

Yep. Yep.

Dr. Noah St. John (33:14.872)

Comprehend because it's like they're doing this unconsciously. They're doing it without thinking, you know, so one example for everyone listening that you can do right now today is Number one understand really what your goals are which we've heard a million times I know that but the point is why do you want them? That's what people don't often talk about is yes. No, I want to make ten million dollars I want to make a hundred million dollars. Great. Why I mean why?

Jeff Holman (33:29.295)

Mm-hmm.

Jeff Holman (33:40.653)

What's behind the money?

Dr. Noah St. John (33:42.476)

what's behind the money. And, you know, for us men, you know, we want status, we want approval, we want recognition, we want fame, all those things. For my female clients, it's often very different. They want to take care of their families, you know. So it's not cookie cutter, one size is all. It's very customized and personalized approach that we take with my coaching, whether it's one on one or group coaching. I'll give you another great example. I have a program called the 12 Week Breakthrough because I'm known for helping people make more than just 12 weeks than the previous 12 months.

Jeff Holman (33:50.841)

Mm-hmm.

Jeff Holman (34:11.481)

Okay, yeah.

Dr. Noah St. John (34:11.52)

Well, winning their lives back. Well, one of my clients named Tamisa, she's a business owner in Arizona, know, great personalities, a lot of fun, but she was a self-described seminar junkie. So she was going to all these seminars, you know, and listen to all the gurus and she was doing okay. She was doing all right, you know, making six figures, but couldn't break through that income ceiling. So a friend referred her to me and she joined my 12 week breakthrough program. Well, in the first two weeks of coaching with me, she tripled her investment, tripled.

Jeff Holman (34:22.382)

Mmm.

Jeff Holman (34:39.214)

Hmm.

Dr. Noah St. John (34:39.998)

in two weeks. Talk about an ROI. So that's a big, big fear that a lot of people have is I've tried everything already. Well, yeah, of course you have because all of them are saying the same thing. Set your goals, think positive, work hard, hustle and grind. No kidding. We've heard that a million times. I'm not saying that advice is even wrong. It's just only going to get you so far. So if you want to break through that income ceiling, that's why, you know, my power habit system and talking about the zero friction CEO, the zero friction framework.

Think about that. Every business problem you're facing right now is a friction problem. That can't be argued because you are stopping yourself. You're slowing yourself down. Not on purpose, not consciously, but whether it's inner game or outer game, it's friction. So we get rid of the friction. Boom. That's why we get hockey stick growth.

Jeff Holman (35:27.651)

Yeah, no, I literally was telling you before the show, hey, sorry, I'm a minute late. I was just resolving a team thing, talking to some team members about this thing. I literally used the friction at least five times, the friction word five times. And I didn't know we were gonna talk about that other than your bio here, but I'm like, hey, we don't need this friction. If we have this friction and it's slowing our process down or our clients feel the friction, like we gotta resolve the friction. We gotta get rid of the friction. So this is this.

Dr. Noah St. John (35:42.828)

There we are.

Dr. Noah St. John (35:49.59)

Right.

Right.

Dr. Noah St. John (35:55.564)

Bingo. Very timely.

Jeff Holman (35:56.528)

you know, really resonates with me very timely. So tell me, tell me, I'd love to hear maybe if we've got time, you know, one more story about one of these breakout moments that you've seen or facilitated, one of your clients has experienced, you know, set the stage for us. What were they, what were they up against? And, you know, why were they maybe hitting a wall or stuck on a plateau? And, and how did the power habits framework or some other teaching or coaching opportunity?

shift their perspective, reframe their problems so that they could then get that hockey stick growth that you talk about.

Dr. Noah St. John (36:32.361)

Yeah. Well, one of my clients, his name is Pat and he has a nine figure business. In fact, so I work, you know, I coach seven, eight and nine figure CEOs. And, you know, again, that's where that $3 billion comes from. And so he, he heard, heard me on a podcast, contacted me, you know, hired me on the spot, you know, another high achiever, you know, fast mover, fast decision maker, love it. And after coaching him for a very short amount of time, literally like, you know, less than three weeks, I

Jeff Holman (36:40.878)

Yeah.

Dr. Noah St. John (37:00.159)

determined pretty quickly that he was doing, as I like to call it, $10 an hour work. Now you're running a nine figure company and you're doing $10 an hour work. You know, so he was literally, you know, answering emails, answering the phone. said, Pat, you cannot be serious. You're answering the phone. goes, yeah, I'm like, yes. I said, you can't be serious right now. I honestly, couldn't believe it. I'm like,

Jeff Holman (37:17.049)

Just like, just like inbound calls. okay.

Dr. Noah St. John (37:25.781)

You know, on one hand I'm going, how the heck did you get to that? How'd you get to nine figures when you're using the phone? I mean, I, swear I was, I was like, you know, blown away by that. said, Pat, you realize you can't do that, right? You, you cannot be answering the phone. And, know, so pretty quickly he got the idea, got the concept and, know, was able to delegate it, you know, and he brought on some new people and they're doing a great job. now, frankly, as a result of coaching with me now, I'm actually coaching him through negotiating a nine figure exit.

Jeff Holman (37:29.805)

Yeah, yeah.

Dr. Noah St. John (37:55.668)

So he's going to be selling, he's going to walk away with a nice chunk of money. And, you know, really, I was able to help him get his really get his life.

Jeff Holman (37:55.777)

Hmm.

Jeff Holman (38:03.855)

Which wouldn't be possible, right? If he's the guy answering the phones, you can't sell, I mean, that's the classic owner operator, you know. Well, nine figures is pretty darn good. Yeah, that's pretty darn good for somebody who owns the business and is also answering the phones. But putting the...

Dr. Noah St. John (38:09.346)

No. I know. I swear I couldn't believe it, but I was like, okay, I think I'm seeing some friction there.

Dr. Noah St. John (38:22.823)

I know I couldn't believe it but there you go you know so hey nine figure exit boom nice nice check and you know sail away into the sunset

Jeff Holman (38:31.439)

Very awesome, very awesome. Well, this has been fantastic. There's so much here. Obviously, we've only had just a taste of what you've got to offer. I'm sure, you know, we've talked about one book, you got 24 more books plus everything else in the first book that we haven't touched on. There's a ton here and this has been fantastic. It might be like we talked about earlier, might need to have you back on the show to do round two or more. But for today's show, what's one thing you would leave?

Dr. Noah St. John (38:53.803)

Absolutely happy to.

Jeff Holman (38:59.359)

either a tip or a recommendation or whatever it might be for our scaling CEOs, people who are, you know, they've had some of these struggles and successes, they've had some breakout moments, but they've got some more breakout moments on the horizon once they figure out how to navigate the struggles that are ahead of them, what can they be thinking about?

Dr. Noah St. John (39:18.057)

Well, when you go to NoahStJohn.com, we have tons of resources, you know, my coaching, my books, but definitely you want to start with that zero friction profit gap audit, the zero friction gap audit. Remember that's free. That's going to the doctor, going to the general practitioner. It's free. And then you definitely want to get the zero friction profit scan because then, you know, that's a cat scan for your business. And you, and if you are, I'll reiterate, if you're, if we don't find a quarter million dollars in profit leaks,

Jeff Holman (39:29.924)

Mm-hmm.

Jeff Holman (39:39.236)

Yeah.

Dr. Noah St. John (39:46.123)

It's free. I've never had to do that because believe me, everyone listening to this program, if you're still hearing my voice, you're definitely leaking probably a good half million, million or more right now. And you don't even know it. So that's what the CAT scan for your business is. We just look at it and then, oh, and by the way, you do get a, you know, a 30 minute call with me afterwards. So we actually, you know, go through it. We call it the report of findings. So, you know, you're going to be talking to the neurosurgeon before we do the surgery, you know.

Jeff Holman (39:48.398)

Yeah.

Jeff Holman (40:10.073)

Mm-hmm.

Jeff Holman (40:14.02)

Yeah.

Dr. Noah St. John (40:14.537)

the surgery is then okay, well, you want to fix it? Or you know, you want to keep having that thing in your brain? Which most people say, Can you fix it? I go yes. So anyway, tons of resources, but the bottom line is tons of resources, Noah St. john.com. And I'd be happy to help everybody listening this program as

Jeff Holman (40:19.427)

Yeah, yeah.

Just got to be dedicated to the treatment plan.

Jeff Holman (40:33.391)

Awesome, awesome. Well, you've shared that. We'll put those things in the show notes too. Maybe we'll see if we can grab a picture of your Venn diagram to put there. But this has been fantastic. really is. It's an honor to talk with you, but it's also real benefit to our audience, right? To listen to these things because so many people, there are not many people that are born without head trash, as you've explained, right? So many of us, we deal with it. It's common, it's normal, it's...

Dr. Noah St. John (40:58.389)

many.

Jeff Holman (41:01.935)

something that if we were in a room with a bunch of other CEOs and peers, they would all say the same thing. If they're honest with us, they'd be like, you know what? Yeah, I actually, I deal with that too. So this is something that I think is really common. I see this again from the legal side behind the curtains of a lot of businesses. And so I know there's a lot of value here and it's been a benefit and a blessing for our audience to be able to hear what you've got to share today.

Dr. Noah St. John (41:30.058)

My pleasure.

Jeff Holman (41:31.011)

Well, thanks for being on the show and thank you to all of you who are out there listening. Again, I'm Jeff Holman with The Breakout CEO and we'll see you next week.

Awesome. I will get this stopped.